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What if Everyone Knew?

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Tomas
The lucid dreamer
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PostPosted: Tue 06 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Amused Himself to Death wrote:
Quote:
A few intelligent people would use their lucidity to increase their productivity. But everyone else would just do the same stupid crap in their dreams, that they do in real life.

Your cynisism swayed my opinion somewhat. However, at the bare minimum, it would help the actually real people be closer with their spirituality. Perhaps even make intolerable situations bearable, knowing the person can escape into another world where the greatest story is told every night.

Lucid Dreaming just needs to become socially acceptable to talk about in day-to-day conversations to be something thats done widely. Lucid dreaming needs a sponsor, some sort of celebrity. Like Beck, or perhaps Thom Yorke.

What does it have to do with spirituality?? Linking lucid dreaming with spirituality, is one of the things that make it lose credibility.

Lucid Dreaming is proven by science, and should never ever be linked with religions in my opinion.


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Mohegan
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PostPosted: Tue 06 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Quote:
What does it have to do with spirituality??


Lucid dreaming has Shamanic origins, therefore it's origins are spiritual. Ignoring that because science looked into it and found it to be true is also discrediting.


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Tomas
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

[Darkness Myth] wrote:
Quote:
What does it have to do with spirituality??


Lucid dreaming has Shamanic origins, therefore it's origins are spiritual. Ignoring that because science looked into it and found it to be true is also discrediting.

People have been lucid dreaming for ages even before the rise of religion. Everyone does it, including shamans, christians, muslims, hindus and so on.

Spirits or the spiritworld has not been proven to exist, while lucid dreaming has.


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Mohegan
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Spirits may not have been proven, but that doesn't mean you should ignore LDings origins and it's links with spirituality (which has nothing to do with spirits) and religon because LDing has been proven.

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TAG_One
Lucid Initiate
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Quote:
Spirits or the spiritworld has not been proven to exist, while lucid dreaming has.


But isn't it still important to question the idea that lucid dreaming could be linked with spirituality? Large areas of psychology are still not properly understood and if everyone chose not to link spirituality and lucid dreaming (and other areas of psychology) we may never truly know whether things like spirits exist or not.

If we want to draw other people to lucid dreaming then it's important to portray the scientific aspect because, like Tomas said, the scientific aspect will give it more credibility than the spiritualistic aspect. But also it's important to look into the spiritualistic aspect in a scientific way so that it can be determined whether things like spirit guides really exist.


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31
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Man creates his own reality by the basis of his own beliefs.

If you believe something, then it's true in your own reality. If you don't, then it's not. Nothing is or is not. Life in and of itself is but a dream.

People who belive in an after life, will have one, because they truly do believe and expect it. People who don't, won't have one and will stop existing right after death, just like they so believe. There is no one truth to our existence.

Make life what you want it to be, just as all of us on these forums make our dreams what we want them to be. After all, life is but a dream.


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Olesia
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

I think that if LDing became "easy", with the help of technology, people would take it for granted. It's like daydreaming - it's easy and free, but it doesn't resemble reality enough to actually change anything.

Even if you do things in your dream, it's still a dream, lucid or not. It could be efficient in some cases, if you have a short-term want of some kind, like going to a club or something. You could go into your dream and go to a club, party, and wake up with no "side-effects" like hangovers or conflicts with friends, etc. But in the long term, it wouldn't change anything. People would start taking LDing for granted, just like most people take their normal dreams for granted.

And if people try something in their LD's that they wouldn't do in waking life, maybe they'll be inspired to do it IRL too. It could be a good thing of course, but it could also be a bad thing. Human beings aren't all good, and I'm sure some people would find a way to use LDing for negative causes.


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Basilus West
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Sonic922 wrote:
So do you think it's goos to spread it around to your friends and others you know, even if it keeps spreading?

Going back on topic (it wasn't initially a topic about a possibly imaginable LD'ing technology in the far future but mainly Sonic922 asking what effect it could have if he spreads LD'ing today amongst friends), I don't think it will change anything. This forum exists for ten years and LD'ing is still quite unknown. It's almost absolutely unknown in France (though it seems there will be a movie about it soon! :D )
Quote:
People may do dangerous stuff if they make the mistake and think they are in a dream(i.e. Try to fly, kill others,etc.)
Some people might get too hooked and spend most of their life sleeping.

The two disadvantages you point out are very unlikely. It's impossible to confuse real life and dreams (unless you're crazy crazy2 ). I don't think that experienced LD'ers spend their life sleeping. It requires effort to have LD's and lazy people are not good at it.

Thus I don't think there will be any advantages or disadvantages in spreading LD'ing (if possible). Now I would give you the advice of choosing well the friends you will speak to. Many LD'ers complained that they have been called crazy by their friends once they told them about LD'ing. Now it's possible to speak on forums, cause people don't really know you and there are often many natural LD'ers who practice LD'ing without even knowing it ("o? realizing you're dreaming is called lucid dreaming? I am doing this all the time...")


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31
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PostPosted: Thu 08 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Wait. What do you mean by "there will be a movie about it soon"?

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Basilus West
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PostPosted: Thu 08 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

It's called "The Science of sleep". It's a comedy. It seems to be rather curious. eh I don't know if it will be a good movie (neither if it will appear in America cause there are only actors who are known in France, it's seems to be heavy-handed french humour and the special effects are absolutely ridiculous lachtraan ). Yet if it's a good idea, US movie makers probably will do a remake.

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31
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PostPosted: Thu 08 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

smile Hopefully it will be worth seeing. I'll get my hands on it somehow to see if it is.

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Amused Himself to Death
pretty close...
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PostPosted: Fri 09 Jun, 2006  Reply with quote

Quote:

What does it have to do with spirituality?? Linking lucid dreaming with spirituality, is one of the things that make it lose credibility.

Lucid Dreaming is proven by science, and should never ever be linked with religions in my opinion.

Lucid dreaming has as much to do with religion and spirituality as the dreamer themself believes. Therefore, this argument is really irrelevant, (religion tends to do this).

However, the entire idea of lucid dreaming and dreaming in general is mind-boggling. Who could imagine the concept that while someone is sleeping, they have a personal dimension that is completely owned and domainated by themself? It's basically another level of life unimaginable to everyone but the creator itself.

Who honestly cares about lucid dreaming losing credibility? People will always have doubts, they will always be close minded. If a simple reference to spirituality in relation to a lucid experience damages lucid dreaming's credibility, let it. The believers will still believe, it would just scare off the pessimistic skeptics. And nobody cares about them tounge2


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