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Posts: 105
Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Last Visit: 16 Dec 2009
LD count: not enough :P
Location: Germany
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| Interesting convo with a dc |
 Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2007 |
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I had a very interesting conversation with a nice DC yesterday.
It was in some explorers society that i became aware that i was dreaming.
As all the DCs around me were very friendly and seemed quite intelligent, rather than strolling around i decided to have a little talk with them.
I explained them that i was dreaming and that all this and them were just made up by my imagination.
Rather than most DCs who demand proof or try to distract me when i tell them these accepted the fact and were quite helpful.
There was this one guy with a viking helmet with a chicken on top that then posed this rather interesting question on me, that i couldnīt quite answer:
"Ok, as we have now established you are dreaming all of this and all of us. So then i ask you: why do you only percieve your world only out of your own perspective? Why will you only remember being you next morning?
Why donīt you see what i see and feel what i feel?"
I couldnīt really give an answer to that, as he was quite right.
IF its all created in my mind and as the DCs are also quite consistent in their reactions and goals, why canīt i remember what they were thinking or experiencing if they are just parts of me?
Why is it the perspective of me (as i am really only a DC aswell in my mind if i sleep) that gets concious?
Any ideas?
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24 |
Posts: 89
Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Last Visit: 22 Nov 2012
LD count: 24
Location: Hungary
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| Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2007 |
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This is relevant to my interests. I'd love to hear what others can say about this.
Current LD goal(s): Talking to dream people
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Posts: 10398
Joined: 05 May 2002
Last Visit: 24 May 2013
LD count: lost uhm lots
Location: behind the mirror ;-)
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| Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2007 |
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| Quote: |
| Ok, as we have now established you are dreaming all of this and all of us. So then i ask you: why do you only percieve your world only out of your own perspective? Why will you only remember being you next morning? |
I love this insight  It's like a sentence to meditate on, really
Beverly D'urso, whom I have met at the IASD psiberdreaming conference worked with laBerge in his early experiments. She told me about this. In one experiment she had to move her eyes when she became lucid, so it became visible on the records. She had done several of these experiments, she was quite used to do this whenever she became lucid, and in one dream one of her DC's asked what she was doing and he also moved his eyes from left to right. And on the graph, the time when the DC moved his eyes (and her eyes didn't move in the dream) it showed up on the graph too! (the same as if she had moved her eyes herself)
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Posts: 846
Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Last Visit: 21 Jun 2012
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| Posted: Wed 31 Oct, 2007 |
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That's very cool, pasquale! I should really try talking to DC's some more, when i do have a lucid dream. Using cool powers and things like are exciting, of course, but talking to the DC's can be soo surreal. I love to hear what they say. It makes one wonder why they said those things - how your subconscious can come up with intelligible (if sometimes only barely  ) reactions.
*wnvoss gained +5 longing for a LD. 
EDIT: And what do you know, after typing that up, I had a lucid dream.
Last edited by wnvoss on Thu 01 Nov, 2007; edited 1 time in total
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28 |
Posts: 1372
Joined: 12 Dec 2005
Last Visit: 09 Jan 2013
Location: Luleå, Sweden
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| Posted: Wed 31 Oct, 2007 |
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Quick but boring answer. He has no experience, he is only an illusion.
Another answer, the same reason you don't experience other people's experiences when awake.
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Posts: 30
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Last Visit: 13 Feb 2008
LD count: 8!!!!
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| Posted: Tue 04 Dec, 2007 |
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I'd say that you (in your dream) are your conscious while everything else is your SC. You don't feel everything your SC does in WL do you?
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| Posted: Tue 04 Dec, 2007 |
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Well, mainly because it is not interesting. Just like you will, mostly, not remember many colors and small details.
Ofcourse, that if he did had some sort of a strong feeling, you would be sure to remember that upon awekening. Then, It may be interesting.
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Posts: 46
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Last Visit: 17 Jul 2008
Location: Gata
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| Posted: Wed 05 Dec, 2007 |
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Well, sometimes if I PuppetMaster a dream, I can remember what my DC's were thinking. But's that only because I created them and their motives in the depths of my mind.
But other than that, you're not supposed to know what a DC is thinking because it is your interpretation of a human being. You shouldn't be able to always know what they're thinking (unless you convince yourself you're a mind reader in your dreams, or you're used to reading minds in daily life).
Dreams are like hooking a mind up to a projector. The only thing that can be seen on the white screen are the ideas that come from that mind. A dreamer is merely interacting with himself.
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Posts: 113
Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Last Visit: 25 Nov 2010
LD count: 1 so far
Location: City Under The Bridge
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| Posted: Fri 07 Dec, 2007 |
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Lol! That sounds just like my philosophy class! Philosophy isn't my best subject... so I can't help you there. But that's a very nice question, all the same.
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Last Visit: 03 Jul 2008
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| Posted: Thu 03 Jul, 2008 |
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wow, that's really getting into the nature of consciousness itself. In our waking lives the 'I' is consciousness on the surface, but it also encompasses all the other regions of what we are as well. it is only in dreams we can separate the conscious 'experiencer' from all the other aspects of ouselves and stand them against each other. I guess the answer is that the 'I' of a dream is not a whole person or a physical entity, but the part of our brain which deals with consciousness. It experiences a sequence of sensory simulations, and that is a dream. The dream character is not some element of a fundamental 'you', but a hallucination the brain generates for reasons known best to itself. The conscious is not a part of the dream in the same way as a person is a part of reality, it is a mere observer given an approximation of physical form as a part of that hallucination, providing a center to the observation and a link to our waking experience.
I hope that made sense.
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Posts: 101
Joined: 31 Oct 2007
Last Visit: 30 Sep 2010
LD count: Dozens.
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| Posted: Thu 03 Jul, 2008 |
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Wow, your dream characters are more perceptive than most real people.  At any rate, my answer to this would be that you're probably so used to seeing things only from your own perspective that that's the only you can really do so in your dreams. Me, I play a lot of video games, watch a lot of movies, so I am very used to seeing things in third person. Therefore, a good number of my dreams don't come from my perspective at all, but from an overview or the view of someone around me.
I'm sure if you actually tried to will it so, you would indeed be able to see and feel what any other DC, or even an object for that matter was seeing or feeling. I think I smell the beginnings of an experiment.
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Posts: 1165
Joined: 09 May 2007
Last Visit: 15 Sep 2012
LD count: Lost count..
Location: Sweden, Gothenburg
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| Posted: Thu 03 Jul, 2008 |
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But a dream is like an early 3d videogame- "Only draw what is visible" I guess.
Like you look at a person, you cannot see what's behind his back because there is nothing behind his back, it's all empty cos your brain is not making anything- And it doesn't have to cos you can't see it.
This is what we mean by shifting dreamworld- Like when you look at a clock, look away and then look back. The moment you looked away the clock disappeared, and when you looked back it was recreated.
But I think you have a very interesting DC, and if I were you I'd try to find him in my next lucid dream to talk more to him.
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