WILD-Training: please feel free to join me?
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#1: WILD-Training: please feel free to join me? Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Sat 16 Nov, 2013
Hi all,

I want to start something and hope some people will join me. It is easier and more stimulating to start something together with others.

So far I have read many, many books, websites, ... I tried many, many techniques, not just recently, I was more active on the lucid dreamquest serveral years before, and just want to start with it again.

I am, from past experiences, especially inclined to WILD's, because I have a belief, then once you master WILD's, you have more chance to have lucid dreams when you want. But it is such a hard technique. And I read many people struggle with it. So I thought, let's make a training schedule, and try to make gradual progress.

Al things need training, I spend years trying to meditate, but only when a master told me I had to stick with one technique for very long, I began to make noticeable progress. I think it is the same with lucid dreaming.

So here is my training program:
step 1: familiarize myself with sleep paralyses.
step 2: Euhm, I don't know yet, I guess I will know when I am ready with step 2

Anyhow, I want to start with familiarizing myself with sleep paralysis. The aim of this training is not to get lucid (I will not stop it, if it happens, but it's not the goal), just trying to get as much as possible in the SP state, so I know what to expect, so I know how to get there easily (if possible). Only if I master this to some degree, I will go a step further direction lucidity.

The problem with WILD is that it is very hard, and because you want to lucid dream so badly, sometimes you get to focussed and it is hard to fall asleep. Not in this training. Lucid dreams are not the goal, the goal is to get the most SP experiences possible. In the knowledge this will help me to get more easily lucid in the future!

I have encountered many sites that stress on experiencing SP first, experiencing all kinds of trance states and so on, to get to know the tricks.

So here is what I am going to try in step1 of my training:
1.a. learn to fall fully asleep as quickly as possible
1.b. wake up from this sleep as often as possible
1.c. learn to stay still, and keep eyes shut everytime I wake up
1.d. eventually have as much SP experiences as possible

Step 1.a. is very important: if you want WILD's you don't want to fall fully asleep as quickly as possible, because that is opposite to WILD, but it is required to learn more about SP, but only in combination with 1.b. you have to wake up from this sleep often, to learn to stay still with eyes shut (1.c.), because this helps you to get very close to SP, and that is our aim for the training in step 1.

So, who is in?
I will start this night, or rather next morning, because it is very hard to practise these kind of things at the moment of falling asleep.

Here is my plan for now, but please inspire me with other tips:
I will set my alarm at 4 or 5 in the morning, get up (WBTB) for a while (not to long for me, I am a bad sleeper), and then go back to sleep.

1.a. I will try different techniques to fall asleep quickly: focussing breath, focussing throat, just space out, daydreaming, mimicking my sleep breath, ... (this step is very personal, everybody is so different). Anyhow, only very little focus, because aim is to fall fully asleep, not to stay awake with the mind.

1.b. I will play a mp3 file with frequent beeps that will wake me up again, but other things are possible (drinking a lot so you wake up alot to pee, ...), leaving the door of my daughters room open (she makes alot of noices at night, each noice is a change of waking up colgate ), ...

1.c. when I wake up I will try to remember to stay still eyes shut (this is also a very good way to learn to DEILD, see http://www.ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23395&sid =30fe60858f97116092dc2 2770f3735fe)

1.d. when i feel SP i will not get excited, just experience, discover, learn more about this state, I will not try to exit for know, only if it come naturally i will go with the flow, but no focus on this yet.

Please feel free to add tips, different ways to get to the aim or subaims colgate

For 1.c. for now I will use a mp3 from here:
http://www.lucidology.com/get_kit?c=sd-temp_telenet.b e&l=2
Click trough on:
2.) Click: Lucid Dream & OBE Timers (External Link)

I will start with the ramp 4 minutes interval.
But other suggestions are welcome.

I hope some of you like the idea and join. So we can exchange experiences, tips and tricks.

Last edited by dreamystivi on Sun 17 Nov, 2013; edited 1 time in total

#2: First morning Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov, 2013
Hello, here I am again. My first morning practise. It was cool.

The mp3 that keeps waking you up, after 4, 8, 6, 20, ... Minutes, variable, has a very strange effect on me. It keeps me hoovering around sleep. I always have hard time falling asleep again, and often I hear the next beep, before I fell asleep, not in the first hour, but more and more in the second hour and on. But it gives me time to experiment with techniques that get me closer to sleep many times. Also when the beep goes off before I fell asleep, I can remember very well to keep still and stay with eyes shut, so I can condition myself to always do it like that.

So these are some things I experienced during this early morning practise (I started around 4, after WBTB):
Popping in and out sleep and dreams
Very short dreams in which I am trying to fall asleep (false awakenings)
Rushes over my body
Hearing voices, strange noises
Caution: one small nightmare (but that's ok for me)
Many behind the eyes visuals
Meditation like experiences.
Easy to play with my mind, dissolving my body, staying in empty space
Very deep breathing
After some time mind not falling asleep anymore, hearing the beeps, but not disturbing, body very, very still, but not sure if it was really paralysed. For sure difficult to move, but still possible with willpower.

The last experience, the body very very still, and the mind very awake was interesting, that was the meditation like state, the state in which I could easily play with my mind. I could imagine to dissolve my body, until I felt and heard nothing anymore, but entering a dream body or separating from my real body by imagining to roll, turn around, being somewhere else etc, didn't work. Also no strange noises and feelings, so I guess it was no real SP.

I didn't know how to get to real SP, I guess I had been partially in SP, any tips on how to get further to real SP?

I feel little tired today, so I decided to go for the following schedule:

In weekdays I will only practise this once every two days, so one night my mind and body can rest and, who knows, get some spontaneous effects from the previous night, the other night practise.
In weekends: every night practise, and if possible a day nap, also with practise.

I hope this is also inspiring for others, if not, please let me know, then I will shut up and just record these experiences just for myself colgate

#3:  Author: ThePencilSharpener PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov, 2013
i'm in but the thing is that i have never had a LD so i will be trying to do that while i learn to deal with SP

#4: Nice you are in Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov, 2013

I understand your main aim is a lucid dream, that's also my aim, or more precise to have a lot of LD's. But I want to take a gradual process now. But it is perfectly ok if you join and strive to have your first LD in the process. Anyhow, doing this practise will greatly enhance the chance to have a lucid dream, for sure.

So good luck, and keep me updated, maybe I can help, maybe we can help each other.

#5:  Author: Mew151 PostPosted: Mon 18 Nov, 2013
WILD Training? grin
I like how your method is to get used to SP and everything, but I must say that "normal" SP isn't required to WILD. If you don't encounter "normal" SP phenomena such as hearing voices, it doesn't mean that you aren't in SP.

dreamystivi wrote:
I didn't know how to get to real SP, I guess I had been partially in SP, any tips on how to get further to real SP?

Well, I think that your mind may have been too awake. Especially considering that you said your "mind [was] very awake" and that you were "playing with your mind". For WILD you need to keep your mind awake, but not so awake that your body will not fall asleep. And not so little that your mind falls asleep with it.

Good luck on your WILD quest!

#6:  Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Mon 18 Nov, 2013
Hi Mew,

Thanks for you post.
I don't know very much about the SP in WILD. In many descriptions I read they talk about the SP. When I did wilds years ago, I always passed through SP (maybe because I was expecting it that way).

I believe that when you get more accustomed to the state where SP takes control, and the deep trance states in which this is possible, it must be much easier to have LD's at will. That's what I am going to find out colgate

I recently had two lucid dreams trying to get in this SP state, so I decided to explore it more systematically now.

Anyhow, it is good to know you don't need full SP to get Lucid and it is good to know you actually can be in SP without these sounds and rushing feelings. I will keep this in mind, maybe I am looking to far for now, but I don't mind at the moment, I want to know much more about SP for the moment.

And yes, I know, in the end my mind became to active, I just couldn't fall asleep any more, Lucid dreams and even SP are out of reach I guess when mind is to active. It is always like this, when I get to a point where my mind gets to awake, I can spend hours and hours in this state, and nothing happens, it is like deep meditation, it feels good, but is not what I am aiming at for the moment. That's why I begin to play with my mind, to see if I can tire it again, because if I just do nothing, nothing happens.

Any ideas how to knock this active mind out and fall back asleep anyhow? In this stage of the training, I can really fall asleep again, because the beep will wake me up again anyhow. I think it is easier to learn what my mind and body needs to fall asleep if I don't even have to try to stay slightly awake.
Later on I will use what I have learned to be able to fall asleep with my mind slightly awake = WILD.

#7:  Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov, 2013
I woke up at 3:30 this morning, got up, and after some stretching went back to bed, playing the mp3. But it was much harder to fall back asleep this time. Maybe because it is a weekday, I am more tense probably, also I am suffering from a light cold, and my daughter was coughing a lot in a room close by, so not so good conditions.

Anyhow, managed to get to the numb state after some time, but almost hearing every beep while still awake, so the beep was not waking me up. Maybe I should make an mp3 myself and leave more time 15 minutes or more between the beeps. I will try that.

In this state I always feel good, it doesn't matter anymore if I sleep or not, but this time I tried to keep my mind as low as possible, to be able to fall asleep anyway, I came to the edge several times, feeling some tingling feelings starting in some parts of my body, but it faded away again. At one point I fell really asleep and dreamed that there where two men in the room I was in. I asked them if they could help me to pull myself out of my body, but then in some way I could look at myself (in the dream) and saw I was looking totally different then myself, so I said, no, that's not me, don't pull me out like that, because then I will be somebody else. Lol, my damn mind was playing nasty tricks with me again, I woke up from this.

So, no real progress this morning. But it is interesting though. And I feel that I am close to SP, maybe that is SP, because body is really, really still, numb, stiff, if I want to move, I have to make great effort, and if I do, my body still feels very heavy the first seconds. Maybe the tingling feeling is the start of the separation process (or the transition from focus in real body to dream body), it is not yet very clear to me. But that is the purpose of a training, isn't, repeating the same thing over and over, until you get the hang of it.

I will just sleep normally the next night, and then try again, maybe try to make my own mp3 file by then. Or if somebody of you has a very good mp3 that seems to fit in this training plan, you are very welcome to share it.

#8:  Author: Samyten PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov, 2013
I'm in.
And for SP, i have encountered it many times, and i nearly don't see it pass. I know it's SP but i don't feel really paralyzed, and i don't get hallucinations. It's different depending on people wink5

#9:  Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov, 2013

Welcome Sammy, keep us updated.
And yes, probably SP will be different for different people.

#10: Better in falling back asleep Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Wed 20 Nov, 2013

Although it was my rest night, I couldn't resist to keep my awareness on in the night a little, but I realised that it kept me from quality sleep, and it was like this until I saw on my clock I still had an hour of sleep. Then decided to stop with trying to keep up my awareness (yes I tied it all night long, it was always somewhere in the back of my head, I slept some moments, for sure, but rather tense, no dream recall). So I turned off my awareness and just tried to fall asleep, I read yesterday in an old dream journal of me, I used to do following technique: counting backwards from 100, and imaging going down steps at the same time, not to focused, just enough focus to count and step. This had very nice effect on me, I started falling asleep, I reached SP, the strong, vibrant type of SP, where my whole body was shaking. But I got little to excited, and off it went. I tried again, came close to SP again, but not close enough before my wake up alarm went off.

But I am happy, I guess I found a good way for me to be able to fall asleep again. Tonight I will try this together with WBTB and timer mp3.

#11:  Author: The Nameless One PostPosted: Wed 20 Nov, 2013
I should join, I'll say more later once I can give it a good read. But you know, I'm in.

#12:  Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Wed 20 Nov, 2013

Welcome Nameless!

#13: From SP to LD? Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Thu 21 Nov, 2013
Ok, another night of practise; now with my own created mp3:
beep at 20 min, 18 min, 16 min, and again 20-18-16, and again, ...

Got up at 4, out of bed, not to long and then back to sleep, with mp3.
I could fall rather easy to sleep again with the following technique:
counting from 100 to 0, at some points I got lost in counting or began to count wrong, but that's cool, a sign that I got very close to sleep. If I reached 0 before I was asleep I continued walking down steps. This often brought me back to sleep before the next beep, and on the beep I just stayed there, eyes closed.

I begin to believe that most of the time when I woke up from the beep, I was in SP, maybe not full, but certainly to a degree. Body very stiff, not easy to move, possible with great will power, and when i did it broke the SP. Anyhow, I am convinced now that I have no problem putting my body to sleep, the problem is doing something with this SP.

The first two hours I always tried to fall more asleep, because nothing happened in that SP, I then fell asleep completely (also with my mind), until the next beep, and then again in the (semi?) SP. So I am little stuck here.

The last hour my body stayed asleep, but my mind didn't fall asleep anymore, so I heard every beep with mind awake and it was rather annoying (the beeps). So, I am going to adjust my mp3 that after two hours it stops beeping.

In the last hours I started experimenting with trying to get from physical body to dream body. Very difficult for me. I can't get loose from my physical body.
I tried:
-imagining rolling over: didn't get realistic
-imagining falling through the bed: was better, slight sense of another body, but not enough to shift my attention completely on it, after some time, physical body won again.
-imagining myself in another room: didn't get realistic, gave to much tension for my mind
-daydreaming: letting my mind go completely loose, not paying any attention: was good, static dream images began to show, very vaguely, sometimes tingling feeling, but after some time, physical body took over again.

I did all this until my wakup alarm rang.
I am stuck. I need some advice. How to shift from SP to a dreambody?
I read many people can shift very easily to dream body once in SP, not for me. I can't break loose. I am stuck in my physical body.

I learned that the signs I was waiting for I thought to be the signs of SP (tingling feeling, rush of energy, weird sounds, ...) are actually not SP related but related to the transition form physical to dream. So that's cool, I learn new things, begin to understand myself better in these states close to sleep. Maybe I should explore little more like this, before wanting to go further.

#14:  Author: The Nameless One PostPosted: Fri 22 Nov, 2013
Ok, so I'll start to get more familiar with SP. One of the two times I got lucid (and they both sucked, but whatever) I got there from SP. I naturally wake up all the time, but I move around, open my eyes, etc. It's going to take a bit to grow out of those habits.

#15:  Author: dreamystivi PostPosted: Fri 22 Nov, 2013
Cool, you wake up a lot, then you definitely have to change your habit of moving and opening your eyes. This together with knowing SP very well will probably give you a lot of chances to become lucid.

The best way to change this habbit, is to have lot of waking ups, so I hope you use the mp3, because this does just that.

Good luck.

From me no news at the moment. I am suffering from a cold, so I need my sleep now :-(

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