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The BIG WILD topic - part XVII

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Lucid_Mike
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The BIG WILD topic - part XVII
PostPosted: Wed 02 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

<mod>
Part XVII <--you are here
Part XVI
Part XV
Part XIV
Part XIII
The next parts are in the archive - you will need to login again to read those and is accessible for members only:
Part XII
Part XI
Part X
Part IX
Part VIII
Part VII
Part VI
Part V
Part IV
Part III
Part II
Part I
</mod>


LiQuiDreamz wrote:
doing it as you nap is easier


For some people. I'm not a napper regularly, and I find that my dreams are extremely choppy and I rarely get LDs from naps. Just me though, a lot of people have great success with naps.

Madshadow wrote:
So to sum it all up, if I need to know that if I sit there counting, relaxing, ect, will a WILD come to me


Sit? I think you should lay down, remember, you need to sleep to dream. grin I think that's what makes it so hard, you have to let your body fall asleep while your mind stays awake... not a natural thing to do.

Cynster wrote:
I don't think the WILD method is guaranteed for everyone and if you really want success with it you should combine it with WBTB. And if you're someone who takes a long time to fall asleep, it's not the best tech


You're right on. WBTB greatly increases the chance for an LD, WILD or DILD. And you're right on saying that WILD is not a guaranteed thing. Although studies are still ongoing, I think it's fair to say that DILD's are MUCH more common. But, the great thing about practicing for a WILD is: a) When it works, its instant success, b) If it fails, you've just auto-suggested yourself for a great chance of getting a DILD.

eyegug wrote:
should i try WILD with music or the TV on to help me get HI or should i continue trying WBTB and not getting HI...


For me, that may be too much stimulus, but it's different for everyone. It might work like the counting and keep you alert as your body falls asleep?

Madshadow wrote:
But I do have a question. Every time I do try WILD, I count, and At some point, I do not remember counting to that number, I feel that I drifted out, and "woke up" again at that time. Is this what is happening?


That's the challenge, sounds like you've fallen asleep, body AND mind. When you lose count, that tells you that you're on the edge. At that point I have a lot of HI going on.

Madshadow wrote:
Eh, the more I try WILD, the more discouraged I become. I tried it recently, and it leaves me tired, really hot, and when I do sleep, I do not remember my dreams as well as I normally do.


That horrible balance again, I do that too, work so hard to keep my mind alert that I accidentally keep myself awake. I've hovered on the brink of sleep for hours at a time. You can actually get quite a rush off that, but the goal is to fall asleep! grin

Well, I guess if it was an easy thing to do, EVERYONE would do it.


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Robin
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PostPosted: Thu 03 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

Guys, do you have some kind of pre-WILD techniques to make you feel more comfortable in bed, be more relaxed from the beginning? Often when I try WILD, I'm not very patient and it feels hot and (this may sound strange) I don't know how to put my hands and feet. Feet are a little easier, I can lay them over each other, but hands, there are the single fingers. I have to find a position for them to fall asleep. oO

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mocha55
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PostPosted: Thu 03 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

Is there some position that you should take when attempting a WILD? I often try to just lay down straight with a pillow under my head and then try to get my body to fall asleep. Though in the process I either fall asleep without realizing it or I just stay awake. I think last night I was close to the state where HH and HI should occur. Any advice on how to get to that state and getting through it to the point where the LD should appear?

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Cynster
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

Madshadow wrote:
Eh, the more I try WILD, the more discouraged I become. I tried it recently, and it leaves me tired, really hot, and when I do sleep, I do not remember my dreams as well as I normally do.

For me, I just tried WILD again the night before last and although I didn't succeed, I was happy because my normal dream recall did increase, so I think trying WILD helped in my case, sorry it seemed to have the opposite effect on you, Madshadow. I have been having horrible lack of recall lately and after trying to have that WILD the other night, I actually recalled two dreams in one night, and one I even remembered all the way in the morning after I had dreamt other dreams after it.

As to my "almost" WILD the other night, this was only the second time I'd really, really tried to do it (the first time my body started getting numb but then my brain fell asleep) and my mind started feeling like it was a swirly black void, it was like all of a sudden, something was different or changing with me and I tried not to get too excited and scare away the feeling but darn it, then my boyfriend came in from the living room to go to bed and he turned on the TV and it broke my concentration even though I tried like heck to hold onto it, the external happenings were just too intrusive at that early stage of "something starting to happen" in my mind.

I'm not sure how relaxed my body was at that stage either. It's like the first time I really tried WILD, my body was more relaxed and the second time my mind was starting to trip out but still alert and my body didn't seem as relaxed. But to me both experiences were signs of enough progress to make me happy and leave me inspired to try again. I wanted to try again last night but I was having horrible pains in my stomach and there was no amount of meditation that would take them away so I just let myself drift off to sleep. Better luck tonight, I hope.

I still need to solve the problem of the bed partner intruding on my WILD attempts. whatsthat Some have suggested that I incorporate the sounds of my boyfriend's TV-watching into my chanting somehow, but it's easier said than done. And even with a black sleep mask over my eyes, the glow from the TV gets through; also any movements he makes disturb my concentration. Yes, I even try sometimes to beat him to bed really early but it's hard to do that most nights. And WBTB is even more difficult for me and my schedule.


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LiQuiDreams
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

mocha55 wrote:
Is there some position that you should take when attempting a WILD? I often try to just lay down straight with a pillow under my head and then try to get my body to fall asleep. Though in the process I either fall asleep without realizing it or I just stay awake. I think last night I was close to the state where HH and HI should occur. Any advice on how to get to that state and getting through it to the point where the LD should appear?


Well, it is said that sleeping on your back is probably the best position for WILD's; but i, and many others, cannot feel relaxed enough in that position. So, generally, any position where you can feel totally relaxed, and your body can fall asleep without causing you any inconveniance later on in the induction, is a good enough position.

As for getting to the HI stage, all i can tell you is to try to keep your (logical) mind alert; counting to 100 while saying "I'm dreaming" and back to 1 and so forth, is a good way. Not too alert that you can't sleep, but not not alert enough that you do fall asleep.

As for getting through the HI's, i am struggling with that myself. sadblauw

This thread could help.


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mocha55
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

Thanks for the link, I may try this tonight and if or when I wake up at night. I sort of always wake up at around 4 to 4 and a half hours naturally, I think I autosuggested it to myself unconciously that I will wake up at that time. I should maybe do that with WILD. So I guess the main thing to do is find a natural balance so you can WILD successfully.

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Lucid_Mike
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

Cynster wrote:
And WBTB is even more difficult for me and my schedule.


I've heard it said that WILD is useless to try when first going to bed for the night, that you are so far off your REM sleep that the chances are very dismal.

Now, as we've mentioned, we know that its possible to LD and dream in any stage, it's just more likely during REM, hence the end of the night, hence WBTB.

This may make a good experiment for the Experiment Section, how are peoples WILD attempts with and without WBTB?


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JesseRevis
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

My WILD attempt without WBTB turns up short unstable LD's.

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don20853
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

I have been working on WILD for a few months now and what mocha55 said
Quote:

So I guess the main thing to do is find a natural balance so you can WILD successfully.

is the most important.
I lay in bed just like I do when I go to sleep, on my side with one hand up by my head. For some people this makes it impossable for them to keep the mind awake, for me it works. ( at least better then anything else. I do have some very short LD's this way. grin ) For me, I can get the best balance between sleeping body and awake mind this way. It is also important to keep the correct balance for you between paying enough attention to what is going on with your body, and not paying attention. If you pay too much attention, you will get excited, or just not let your body get sleepy enough. If you pay too little attention, then you just slip into sleep.
The main point is try to keep the balance, and don't expect it to work right away. I have gotten my longest LD with WILD, but because of lots of stress in my life right now, nothing else seems to work. sadblauw
don


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Cynster
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

I believe that Darxide is an expert at WILDs with WBTB:
http://www.ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18637

And dunlar is good at WILDs without WBTB but I don't have time right now to find the topic where we were discussing that (it was in the beginning of June this year).


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mocha55
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PostPosted: Sun 06 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

I tried to WILD Last night but I didn't really concentrate on the thought that I was going to WILD, I basically just told myself that I was going to go to sleep normally while doing multiplications. So I started at 1x1 until 1x9 then moving onto 2x2 to 2x9 and so on in that fashion. Then I reached 12 x 12 and so I moved onto more difficult equations visualizing the numbers in my head so that it'd be easier to multiply. I tried 24x12 and I could vividly see the number but took no notice to this. When I was just about to answer the equation my body became quite numb and heavy, I was wondering if this was what WILD was sort of like, and so I finished my equation but by that time my breathing felt shallow and I tried not to concentrate on it because when I do i try to control it so that I can breath, and so my breathing became longer and deeping and not so shallow. So.. that was what happened.

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Lucid_Mike
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PostPosted: Sun 06 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

The experience of close to sleep sounds the same, but you may have extra trouble crossing over with too much mental exertion. I changed my counting on inhales to double counting, counting inhales and exhales, to increase my mental alertness. You're quite a few steps ahead of that, you may need to do something less intensive to cross over.

Just my thoughts.


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Robin
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PostPosted: Sun 06 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

I failed WBTB WILD today and found out that making out little scenes, like imagining you're talking to a person is very helpful in falling asleep (for people that have problems with this).

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mocha55
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PostPosted: Sun 06 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

I may try that, so 1 inhale, 2 exhale. That sort of thing?

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Lucid_Mike
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PostPosted: Sun 06 Aug, 2006  Reply with quote

mocha55 wrote:
I may try that, so 1 inhale, 2 exhale. That sort of thing?


That's what I do. I found that counting once per breath, especially once breath had slowed down, was too little mental exertion. This seems to keep me involved without too much exertion. Once I hit 100, I start back at 1 and keep going.


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