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Character Assisted Lucid Dreaming - CALD

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shatterspike1
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

Talon, what do you mean by IWL? Is it like a trance?

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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

shatterspike1 wrote:
I attempted last night with (a much diffrent) Shatter, and my Wolf SG/Subconsious charcter Terragus. It didn't work. I will try again, and also I ask for tips.

Make sure to try and get involved in the conversation and that you do it while your sleepy-- I was content with where I was in the conversation, and ended it with 'he'll help me go lucid' before I went to sleep immediately.


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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

Angstyboy wrote:
Hmm... This is really starting to sound a lot like tulpas, now.

Yes, my audio method not only increases my visualization when developing my characters, but also sets a general mood that I can then associate with whichever character(s) I am developing at the time. I also am prone to rerun a character through the same scenario countless times to the same song. Basically, "perfecting the scene". This can cause me to become an exacting vetriloquist. I really need to learn to let them - as the song goes - "Just Be"...

As for the origin/nature of my characters, I've actually adopted a few dream characters to develop. I do, however, have several other characters that came to me in WL. I've discovered that each have their individual quirks when it comes to development. Dream characters require less energy than WL-developed characters.

The question you didn't seem to understand - nevermind - you answered it fine. And, I seem to have no more questions as of the moment. Thank you for answering my other questions, though ^^


is Tulpa good or bad?
Anyways-- it seems complex, I really do love your audio development technique-- may I try it some time?

I have a few from dreams, but I don't refer to them as characters, as I did not create them consiously... I made resolution with them though, as a member of the four hurt me O-o;; (slit my shoulders--agh!). I made it a goal to find them in a lucid after my brief while of talking to them smoothly.

I'm glad I answered your question well! :3
Thanks for the replies, it has made me joyous this day.
-Talon


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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

shatterspike1 wrote:
Talon, what do you mean by IWL? Is it like a trance?


Irl is In real life, or in waking life, as you put.
I interact with my characters while I am awake. I go into that state of mind in which you day dream-- lose focus slightly with that around me ( I dare not go entirely, I'm too aware of my enviroment for me to do that...my reflexes when I am startled are bad...^^;;) and I go inside my head for a bit, to the place where I think. After that, I try to will Talon and Naknus there, but only ever one at a time... I will try both one day, but one is intimidating enough, with the knowledge I no longer can predict what they say... Anyways, it is not a trance, but I do KIND OF go into a trance when I speak with them... I did this way of going lucid right before I slept, I was in bed already, sleepy... so perhaps I was mostly asleep while I spoke with them...

Did I answer your question...?


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VisionDreamz
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

I was wondering the same thing. I think it answered my question. So... let's see, is this how it goes? You relax somewhere and enter "mindspace", then imagine Aria into the space, and then you 'summon' one of those two main characters and begin talking to them. Do I kind of get it? I want to learn how to do this. It's sounds brilliant

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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

VisionDreamz wrote:
I was wondering the same thing. I think it answered my question. So... let's see, is this how it goes? You relax somewhere and enter "mindspace", then imagine Aria into the space, and then you 'summon' one of those two main characters and begin talking to them. Do I kind of get it? I want to learn how to do this. It's sounds brilliant


Lol, no... Mindspace and Aria are two different places.
However, they are both personal to me... you can make places all your own! It doesn't matter the name... Mindspace is the name of the place where I go think, and Aria is a world I am designing in my head. Aria is where my characters live, and is a personal project of mine to draw and publish one day...

But anyways, since both are closely related ( I visually imagine them in my head, they are seperated by a wall) my characters can go from one to another, but LIVE in Aria.

I go and relax, usually in bed as I fall asleep (for this at least), 'will' (summon) the character I want to talk to (usually only Talon or Naknus, because I can talk to all my characters in Aria...).

I have 'organised' what's inside my head with three primary levels:
Aria, which I made myself, thus the closest to the surface,

Mindspace, my consious mind where my thoughts are, connected to Aria, but visually I see it diagonal and lower from Aria.

Then my unconsious mind, which is connected to mindspace, and again, lower and diagonal to. They're all connected like steps, at different levels.

When I sleep, I have the belief that my dreams start in mindspace, and may even occur in it. But my dreams come from my unconsious mind. SO, by having highly developed characters, I can put them in mindspace as I sleep and try to convince them to get me lucid. But...since the key is to have characters seperate from your consious control to do this...

I can't always convince them to do it! Hah XD.

Yesterday, I couldn't convince Naknus to get me lucid, and it's hard convincing Talon to do ANYTHING. So she halfheartedly said she'd try... meh... Regardless to say I didn't go lucid... but I had lots of vivid dreams... that I can only remember scenes of! XD Ah well. Lucid dreams I always remember each time so...

Yus. Did I answer the question...? O-o; (forgive the ramble)


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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

What I gather so far is that Talon Arana is your character you've created in your mind. When you go to sleep you know this character so well that it appears in your Dream and will make you become Lucid. Forgive me but this sounds a little strange to me... are these 9 characters sort of "imaginary" friends or are they characters you've thought up and are using for the purpose of your dreams?

As you said, it took you 3-4 years to develop your characters but... to develop your characters what sort of steps did you take? As in, did you lie in bed thinking of first the name, then the looks, etc. and go over them repeatedly so you remember them clearly? I find it difficult to think up an entire personality in which I would know off by heart.


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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

NeoMarine wrote:
What I gather so far is that Talon Arana is your character you've created in your mind. When you go to sleep you know this character so well that it appears in your Dream and will make you become Lucid. Forgive me but this sounds a little strange to me... are these 9 characters sort of "imaginary" friends or are they characters you've thought up and are using for the purpose of your dreams?

As you said, it took you 3-4 years to develop your characters but... to develop your characters what sort of steps did you take? As in, did you lie in bed thinking of first the name, then the looks, etc. and go over them repeatedly so you remember them clearly? I find it difficult to think up an entire personality in which I would know off by heart.


Well, first of all, my 9 characters were never made with the intention to help me in dreams, they are characters I draw in a story SET in Aria. I roleplay with them, draw them, write stories with them. Everything you'd expect a character to be. But I took another step, because I know from interviews with certain manga artists, that the key to conveying a convincing character is to treat them like real people, and get to know them as much as possible. I gave them as much life as I could, and for Talon and Naknus, they turned out much more realistic then the rest (personality wise). And, it's not that Talon appears in my dreams (naknus never did) It's that I believe they exist solely in my mind, so I can ask them to help me with related subjects. So...Maybe this works for me, because in this complex way I convince myself "someone will help me go lucid" or maybe me characters actually do something, in the way I have made things work in my head... I dunno :P.

Call them 'imaginary friends, tools' whatever you'd like, :3 I use my characters in an array of things, expressing myself through art is one, helping in my contemplation is another ( I constantly think, having a kind-of-but-not-really view of things is nice, since I detach myself from their character early on in development), even stress relief. Lucid dreaming, since it has been an intrest of mine for almost half a year now, has become one of the things I use my characters for, and the only ones that seem to fit the work is Talon and Naknus, my most developed.

I developed my characters through roleplaying, and just adding to them as I see fit.
Mostly, when I make a character, I get a flash of how they will be, and work towards that by drawing them and giving that vague body a kind of personality. After awhile of trying to make them convincing to myself, they eventually start to become almost automatic in their responces.

E.g: When making Ein, I saw a quiet hateful type, so I would test that out with roleplaying, and he changed into a more quiet, thoughtful type, with much hidden stress and such...

Well my point is, I made my characters for the fun of it, for the joy of drawing them, roleplaying with them, writing stories about them... and sharing them with others who might be interested. It didn't occur to me to use them as lucidity tools until a few nights ago when it crossed my mind as I was going to sleep...:3

Did I answer you questions...? ^^;

-Talon


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Dream Dragon
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

Wow lots there.. smile thanks you definately answered my question.

You say you draw characters... perhaps you're interested in helping out in LD4ALL Flash Film Project?

Link: http://ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23413


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VisionDreamz
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PostPosted: Sun 06 May, 2007  Reply with quote

You could write a book about the process of creation and all of the things you've created and the many purposes and applications for those creations. You could even include a biography of how you got started and the similarities between your process and what other artists and writers do. I would totally read it. I havn't heard of these sort of techniques before and they sound totally brilliant. I think we should add the LD induction part into the lucid dictionary as something like Character Assisted Lucid Dream (you could write the definition), or maybe something simpler or more complex or whatever : )

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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Mon 07 May, 2007  Reply with quote

NeoMarine wrote:
Wow lots there.. :) thanks you definately answered my question.

You say you draw characters... perhaps you're interested in helping out in LD4ALL Flash Film Project?

Link: http://ld4all.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23413


Wow, thanks... ummm I don't know about the flash project, perhaps I shall take a closer look a it later, though. XD When I am not swamped with small favours I promised to do @___a;; :3

Thanx for the questions :D~


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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Mon 07 May, 2007  Reply with quote

VisionDreamz wrote:
You could write a book about the process of creation and all of the things you've created and the many purposes and applications for those creations. You could even include a biography of how you got started and the similarities between your process and what other artists and writers do. I would totally read it. I havn't heard of these sort of techniques before and they sound totally brilliant. I think we should add the LD induction part into the lucid dictionary as something like Character Assisted Lucid Dream (you could write the definition), or maybe something simpler or more complex or whatever : )


Thanks so much... XD I am flattered... but I'm only 14 @___a;; and I don't think it's possible for me to publish a book...until I'm 20-something... >>; :D~ I've been trying to think of a name for this stuff... XD CALD is cool, but all the other induction techniques have ILD endings XD Character Induced Lucid Dreaming...? XD Lol...
Thanks for your thoughts, you've really made my day! :D I am so happy that you think it's interesting... If you have any questions, I'd be more than happy to answer them! since I won't be writing any books any time in the near future... XD :3~

-Talon


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Cherriey
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PostPosted: Mon 07 May, 2007  Reply with quote

I don't know about that. I read somewhere about one kid who published a book on potato chips or something. He couldn't have been more than 16.

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Talon Arana
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PostPosted: Mon 07 May, 2007  Reply with quote

Cherriey wrote:
I don't know about that. I read somewhere about one kid who published a book on potato chips or something. He couldn't have been more than 16.


@___a well I know that it's legal and possible for kids to publish books, but I am very young, wouldn't have the resources, the process might change, and I am heading to my first year of art high-school... Agh! :P Still...


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VisionDreamz
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PostPosted: Mon 07 May, 2007  Reply with quote

There was also the one who wrote Eragon!
But I can see you creating many great things for the world when you feel you are ready. By the way, I've started making my own character! They actually do have their own responses, and they get less puppet like over time; I can see that.


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